November 19, 2012
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Jews, Arabs, and The War At the Moment
I rarely know what to make of the conflict in the middle east—made worse by the fact that:
1. I have friends who are Jewish—and orthodox.
2. According to my mother, my dad’s father was Jewish. (And before you go there, blood is blood. Had I married a Jewish man, they would have insisted I be tested for Tay Sachs before I had kids, so the “tradition” that it only counts if the mother is Jewish is moot, IMHO.)
I have read things on both sides.
I don’t know “who started it”, or why.
I do know that both sides kill each other…and claim to be justified.
I know that you CANNOT discuss it with people from either side without a lot of yelling and accusations. When I tried to make sense of it, I have been accused of being either an anti-Semite, or a self loathing Jew.
The problem is…I don’t think ANYONE should be killing anyone else…period. I was shocked when I read that once, the two groups not only got along, they actually intermarried. You could say the problem was religion. When the Arabs embraced Islam, (not blaming, simply observing) that was the end of “peaceful co-existence”.
I was always astonished that when the Christians held the Crusades, the Arabs and the Jews did not join forces against them…since both groups were persecuted, and tortured for their beliefs.
But I am watching the current struggle, and it chills my blood.
Does anyone have something factual (as averse to opinion) that could help me understand this better?
And yes, I know how Israel was formed after World War 2, I know the Palestinians were displaced—and that both groups want the other one GONE…I just can’t even begin to imagine how their conflict could be resolved…and I do wish I could.
Oh…and no using the bible or the old testament, please?
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Comments (7)
I think you hit on the biggest problem. A person can’t talk about the issue without being labeled something ugly and thereby being dismissed by one side or the other. I will say in this day and age people have to get their heads out of their tribal assholes. That goes for all of us.
The answer is in this question. Why can some people befriend people of all cultures and backgrounds while other people can’t?
You might want to look at maniacsicko’s thoughtful treatment
http://maniacsicko.xanga.com/769763637/with-god-on-our-side/
Lots of videos, and it may take some time to get through it.
It’s instructive to remember that who we now call Palestinians are the people once known as Philistines. Today’s Jews, formerly Hebrews, formerly Hebrons, were a nomadic people who first went into what’s now generally Israel as marauders looting Philistine villages, usually in the night. I’m nowhere near being an anti-Semite. My mother is Jewish and her paternal grandparents were Russian Jews who emigrated to the US in the late 19th century. The history of the Early Bronze Age is not really disputed by any non-partisan historian. And the fact that the two peoples consider the same region ancestral homeland, and the same sites holy, isn’t disputed, either. It’s a feud that’s been going on for thousands of years and both sides are strongly committed to it.
As for what’s going on over yonder today: Though we in North America aren’t supposed to know about it, Israel has not been an innocent party by any stretch of the imagination. And the part we are supposed to hear about is that Palestinians haven’t always behaved in ways likely to bring sympathy to their plight. A good set of search terms for your favorite search engine would be something like “Jimmy Carter Gaza”. Us older folks might remember that Carter was the guy behind the Camp David Accords, the second phase of which was successful — a followup to a preceding (failed) effort to address the Palestinian regions (West Bank and Gaza Strip). Jimmy Carter isn’t an anti-Semite, either, and I think most would consider him a reliable, unbiased source. He’s got a darn good handle on what’s what and has written quite a lot about it.
The situation is intractable because Israel is the US’s nuclear tarbaby (in the original meaning of the word, “a difficult problem which is only aggravated by attempts to solve it”). One of the few truths that Mittwit spoke during his campaign is the truth that every US president since Carter has had to contend with: We have to keep kicking that can down the road because the US, by supporting Israel, tacitly supports Israel’s abhorrent treatment of the Palestinians and raises the ire of much of the world — but ending that support is beginning World War Three. Israel is tanked up on weapons, including not just nukes but also chemical and biological, some originating in the US and the rest being products of their home grown defense industry. They’d be attacked, they’d use those weapons, and things would quickly escalate. No other nation or group of nations dares to intervene while Israel commands US support and there is real risk of igniting World War Three that way.
Israel is caught in the middle, too. If they were to call a truce and say that yes, indeed, the Palestinians have a right to be here, hundreds of thousands or millions of Palestinians living as (now) permanent refugees in surrounding countries would seek repatriation — and not a one bringing a job with him. The Israelis who’ve been conditioned since birth to hate Palestinians would resent hell out of that, and civil war would be inevitable. The “Jewish State” would cease to exist.
Petropolitics at its finest, eh? The US and UK needed a cornerstone in the oil rich Middle East, they created it, and here we very predictably are chained to it. It might sink us yet.
@HappierHeathen - The Philistines had disappeared from history by the time the Romans got there and so are only a part of the genes of todays Palestians, who like everybody else, are a mixture of many groups.
@galadrial : You imply that it was Islam’s fault that intermarriage stopped. In fact, if any group did no intermarry it was the Jews.
The situation today is a complex one of colonisation and reaction against it.
If I was a Palestinian, I would fight those who imprison my people and stole their land.
If I was an Israeli, I woulod fight the Palestinians as long as they do not turn away from those who want to drive the Israelis into the sea.
As an Englishman, I let the natives bang their drums and take tea and tiffin on the verandah
I just read http://maniacsicko.xanga.com/769763637/with-god-on-our-side/ post and is in awe. As you say, it is true, if you take one side, the other would say, you are Anti-Semite or Anti-Palestine.
However you look at it, the history behind this is useless. We are living now in the 21st century. So I cannot understand why, people cannot come together and be united. I see this as a part of this love for war mongering. During the elections, my blood curdled when I hear about war with the middle east being mentioned all the time by the Republicans.
it seems to be one of those feuds between neighbors that has lost sight of the original reason for the feud, and continues merely because of the ill-feelings toward one another.